Mama Dragons at Pride

Pride is often celebrated with glitter, music, and rainbow flags—but at its heart, Pride has always been about something much deeper: showing up in love and solidarity so that no one has to wonder if they're alone. Today, we're talking with some of the Mama Dragons who set up booths at Pride festivals across the country, creating spaces where families could find hope, connection, and unconditional love. Joining Sara In the Den are three incredible volunteers: Yanira from Puerto Rico, Jill from Kansas, and Maria from Maryland. Though their communities are hundreds of miles apart, they share a common mission: to make sure every LGBTQ+ person, every questioning child, and every parent who feels overwhelmed knows there's a place where they belong. Whether you've marched in dozens of Pride parades or have never attended one, this episode is a reminder that sometimes the most powerful act of allyship is simply showing up—with an open heart, a listening ear, and the promise that no one has to walk this journey alone.

Special Guest: Maria Smith

Maria currently serves on the Board of Mama Dragons. Her 15+ year career in the financial services industry has been defined by a deep commitment to building inclusive, supportive environments within the workplace. She joined Mama Dragons to learn how to best support her queer child and has become an even more passionate advocate for LGBTQ+ youth and families. Maria lives in Maryland with her husband, their two children, and two Puggles. Her life is guided by empathy, action, and the belief that every person deserves to be seen, loved, and supported for exactly who they are.

Special Guest: Jill Clements

Jill is a mom of 3 living in the Midwestern United States. She coordinates the Mama Dragons Embracelet program. An Embracelet is a handmade bracelet that is like a warm hug around your wrist to remind you that you are loved. Since its inception in 2023, over 42,000 embracelets have been given out by Mama Dragons at events. Over the past four years she’s helped coordinate the Mama Dragons Pride Booth in Kansas City, MO which hosts over 25,000 attendees each year.  A social worker by trade, Jill often can be found giving of her time and resources to a variety of causes whether it is parents of trans kids or kids affected by a parent’s cancer.  In her dream world, Jill would be living in Iceland spending her days hiking and making art and her nights photographing the Northern Lights. 

Special Guest: Yanira Vega

Yanira lives in Vega Baja, Puerto Rico, and is the mother of a young transmasculine son and a daughter. She has been a member of Mama Dragons since 2021, when she sought self-help resources and education to address her gender-diverse family’s experience with an affirming approach. That same year, she volunteered to help coordinate MD groups and assist with the vetting and moderation processes for some groups. Puerto Rico has had its own regional group since 2024, and on March 28, 2026, they held their first local community education event at the closing of the True Self Camp for Respect, where they shared Mama Dragons’ mission to support mothers and families in their journeys and highlighted all the programs available to assist them. Their next event will be on June 27 at the All Out 5k. Yanira is a doctor in Physical Therapy working in home health settings.

Links from the Show:

• Join Mama Dragons today

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Transcript

SARA: Hi everyone. Welcome to In the Den with Mama Dragons, a podcast and community to support, educate, and empower parents on the journey of raising happy and healthy LGBTQ+ humans. I’m your host, Sara LaWall. I’m a Mama Dragon myself and an advocate for our queer community. And I’m so glad to be part of this wild and wonderful parenting journey with all of you. Thanks for joining us. We’re so glad you’re here.

Hello, Mama Dragons. As we have completed Pride Month, we wanted to go back and talk a little bit about what Pride means and what it's like for our Mama Dragons community. Pride is often celebrated with glitter and music and rainbow flags. But at its heart, it has always been about something much deeper, about showing up in love, showing up in solidarity, showing up so no one has to wonder where they belong, if they belong or if they're alone. And today we're celebrating our Mama Dragons presence at Pride across the country with moms who have participated in and helped set up booths at Pride festivals from various states around the country, creating spaces where families can come to find some connection and love and hope, particularly in these difficult times. Joining us today are three incredible Mama Dragon volunteers. We have Yanira coming all the way from Puerto Rico, Jill from Kansas and Maria from Maryland. And though their own communities are hundreds of miles apart, they share a common mission, to make sure that every LGBTQ+ person, every questioning child, every parent who feels overwhelmed, knows there's a place where they can belong. So we're going to talk together about the joy and power of Pride, see it through their eyes and maybe hear some unforgettable moments that happened at their booths and why simply being present can change someone's life. So, Yanira, Jill, Maria, welcome to In the Den. It's so great to have you with us today.

JILL: Thank you.

MARIA: Thank you.

YANIRA: Thank you, very happy to be here.

SARA: So good. I'm really excited to have this particular conversation. We talk about it a lot. We know a lot of us are out there, especially in the month of June, when there's a lot of festivals hitting us around running. And we so rarely get to really talk together about what it's like and why we do it and why it's so important. So before we really dive into some of that, though, I would love to start by having each of you introduce yourselves. Tell us who you are, where you’re from, and what brought you to Mama Dragons. So, Maria, can we start with you?

MARIA: Sure. My name is Maria. I live in Maryland. And what brought me to Mama Dragons was when my child came out about, it's almost four years now. And although I always considered myself an ally, it has a much different take on it when it's your child. So I wanted to be the best support that I could for them. And I knew I didn't have all that knowledge. And so I just started seeking. And I came across Mama Dragons through Facebook, I think, is where I first saw them. Then was directed to the website, which is just an incredible resource, especially for a mom getting her footing, basically. So I'm thrilled to be here all these years later.

SARA: That's great. Thank you. Yanira, what about you?

YANIRA: Well, I'm a mother of two young adults. One is transmasculine and he is 20 years old. And I have a daughter who is 26. I live in Puerto Rico. And when I get to know the truth about my son, he came and told me, “Okay, I need this help with this, I have to find a binder.” That was how he came out to me. I didn't know what that was. I knew I needed to help him and right in that moment I just began searching for answers. So I came to find the answers to many of the questions by looking at some evidence-based articles, but those simple things that help in the affirming of my son, I didn't know where to look at. So when I found Mama Dragons, I was looking for answers to some simple things, but that weren't as common for me. So I began with Mama Dragons in 2021, which was the year when he came out to me. I began searching for answers and support from other moms that were living the same situations that I had. And then of that information that I gained by that experience, I wanted to help as well. So I began that same year volunteering in the vetting process in helping other people find us in the social media. And after that, I wanted a regional group for Puerto Rico because we didn't have one at the time. And we find a way to get that in 2024. So we have now a regional group for Mama Dragons from Puerto Rico. And it was an amazing experience doing that and having that because we need to have visibility. We need answers from other people, persons that are experiencing the same needs and to help affirm our child's, our teens to just have success and live their own selves and their own truth. So, Mama Dragons have been life-saving for me and for my family.

SARA: That's so great to hear. How many Mama Dragons members do you have in your Puerto Rico group?

YANIRA: Our group is near 15 right now.

SARA: Amazing. That's so cool. Thank you for doing that. Jill, how about you?

JILL: Kind of a similar time frame to the other two ladies, my daughter came out as trans six years ago. She's 20 now. I also have a 23-year-old and a 17-year-old. And unfortunately, I didn't find Mama Dragons at the beginning. And I was just really searching for any place to connect and it was really lacking. And so I just went to books and tried to find other people I could connect with. And connected with Mama Dragons about three years later and really just kind of dove in and wanted to volunteer and be that person for other people that I couldn't find when I was searching.

SARA: That's great. Yeah, thank you. Jill, you and I share a very similar story. I think mine came out in 2020 as well and is 20 years old, my trans daughter. And I have a 17-year-old. For me, I do a lot of advocacy. And we're always just kind of around Mama Dragons. There's a lot of active leadership in my state. And so they were just kind of always in the same spaces I was in and that's how I got connected with Mama Dragons. So before we kind of talk about the Pride booths itself. I would love to hear from each of you, what does Pride, you know June Pride, the sort of month's festival and all the things that go with it, mean to each of you personally? And maybe I'll expand that by saying, “When did you go to your first Pride?” Yanira, how about we start with you this time?

YANIRA: Okay, my first Pride was about four years ago. So it wasn't that same year when my son told me about his truth. It was the year after that. That first year I was with a lot of mixed feelings where I didn't think at that time that I belonged in that community to feel Pride. I didn't understand at all. So I needed, at that moment, to unlearn to be able to relearn. And my daughter was a key factor in that as she is also in the community. And I get [indicernible] and mental health help from specialists in that area from True Self Foundation, which is in Puerto Rico, where I have the opportunity to find a binder, the specialist in mental health. And all that first steps to get to a group of other parents that needed support. It didn't work as successfully as at this present moment, but my first Pride, that was a great connection with the community. And those feelings that I didn’t belong or deserved to be there just get gone, instantly. And I kind of felt, Okay, this is definitely a family that we need to be not only allies, we need to do something for example, as simple as going to the bathroom for my son that could be a nightmare in some spaces. So we need to do Pride because we need to one day, not have that nightmares going on. That shouldn't be that difficult for them. And they belong. We need to do the Pride events in order to help more people understand that the affirming of those people and persons is important. So I went with my sister-in-law, neither of my teens were with me at that time. But I have went over these years and it's been amazing. Now I'm going with the T-Mamas that I have in the group, so I am not alone. We keep visibility to each other and that sense of family that we have each other. That's our motto, “We have each other.”

SARA: That's great. I love that. Jill, how about you? What does Pride mean to you?

JILL: So the first time I went to Pride was about four years ago. And I went as a Mama Dragon, volunteering at the Mama Dragon's booth. I mean, I was feeling like it was going to be a scary place, because you just didn't know what you were going to encounter. And it didn't end up being scary. It was full of love. And it was the hope that I needed, that there were still good people, and there were – my community was there, and people were there to protect my daughter, and I wasn't alone which was just a beautiful experience to have because, being in Kansas – and a lot of places across the country – you do feel very alone and you do feel very isolated. And you don't know who you can talk to and where is a safe place and where isn’t. And it was just very comforting.

SARA: Thank you. Maria, what about you?

MARIA: To me, Pride is the one time of year – we show out and show support year around – but in June is especially important for people that are allies to allow all of our LGBTQ community to really show who they authentically are and not feel like there's any judgment or anything like that around them. And so it's almost like promoting, “Okay, this is their reality, and so let's support and show love and support,” more so in June, but it’s 12 months a year to me, anyway. I live in a very conservative area of Maryland. I know when people think of Maryland, they think that it's all extremely liberal. But there are pockets of conservative areas. And I unfortunately live in one of those, or fortunately, because I love where I live. But it can be a little challenging at times. But even in our little county, we have three Pride events and they are all really well attended. Two of them are newer. Two of them have started in the last like two, three years. But the mainstay, one in Westminster has been going for seven years and it grows each year. They’ve had to move locations because they kept outgrowing where they were, which is a phenomenal problem for them to have. And so I went for the first time four years ago and went with my youngest child. And all I can say is that the energy, I mean, it's palpable like the positivity. There's no way anyone going to a Pride festival cannot be in a good mood while you're there. Because it's just all about positivity and love and acceptance and all the good things that our children should feel everywhere where they go in life. But especially when they're there, my kid couldn't get the smile off their face because they felt seen and there was representation, which is so important to see themselves in other people. And I think it was at that Pride that they fell in love with drag queens. And so now we make sure that when we're at a Pride festival, we make sure we go when the drag performers are on because we're like, “Oh my gosh, she is fabulous!” I'm like, “You're right. I need make-up lessons from her.”

SARA: Yes. I think you are right. We want that experience year-round. But Pride is that unique moment when so much of the community comes together. So there's just so many people. And so you just get to see such a bigger picture of the community enjoying the support than you get to see kind of on a day-to-day experience. And Amen for the drag queens.

MARIA: Yes. I love them too.

SARA: But, so Maria, Mama Dragons supports families in a lot of different ways. Why do you think it's important that we are so present at Pride?

MARIA: I think because there are other organizations that have resources and support for parents. But I just think it's so important for Mama Dragons – especially in our situation, it's not very well-known here in Maryland – So I just love that opportunity to share and just tell people “Everything that you need to know or are afraid to ask is right here under our umbrella.” And the community of moms and those and mothering roles is so powerful because I think we can all attest, if you want something done, just give it to a busy mom and they will find a way to get it done. And so I just think, in just hearing that, that they're not alone, because I think sometimes whenever you're going through something, especially with your children, you may think, “I'm the only one in the world.” And so that I think coming into that community of moms specifically is so, so important and so powerful.

SARA: Yeah, agreed. Yanira, what do you hope someone feels when they see a Mama Dragons booth at Pride?

YANIRA: Well, I want them to feel seen, feel comfortable with us, that if they need support or just words, hope, that they can find that in us. For example, when they come and we give them information of what we do or the resources that Mama Dragons is offering to persons in mothering roles, some of them are counselors, facilitators, psychologists, and they want to know “What resources are there for those families that are hoping that I give them that information. There are not enough resources for us to have that support.” So here we can learn or do the questions or have support in, for example, advocacy or the regional groups, what is going on in your community. So what we needed because we are real people having real situations with our kids and I want them to feel comfortable. And it is very important that they know that we have each other and that they can be their true selves with us.

SARA: Thank you. Jill, Maria touched on it briefly that there's something uniquely powerful about having moms. Why do you think that’s so? What's the power in having moms showing up publicly at Pride?

JILL: Well, I have a little funny story from our Pride this year. So the last couple years we've just had an absolute downpour of rain at Pride. And it's been frustrating. But it is what it is. And so I just had a tarp with me. And I threw the tarp down in front of our booth. And it was super muddy. And everybody came up to our booth. And they're like, wow, this is brilliant. And we commented and said, “Well, yeah, this is the Mom's group and we have these extra ideas.” You know, well of course we had a tarp with us to keep people’s feet dry. And then just like the name of Mama Dragons. It just drew so many people in of people's kids saying, “Mom, I'm that's you. You're a dragon. You fight for me.” And It was just so identifying just to see that name and to see the signage that we had this year of “Fight like a Mother.” And I just think that just really drew people in and it identified with who we are as moms and we will do whatever it takes for our kids and to make sure they feel safe and seen and not alone.

SARA: Yeah, I'm sure in states like yours, just a recognition that there are supportive, allied dragon parents out there, that that's a thing that exists in the world, particularly for those kids who maybe didn't experience that in their upbringing, always find that really a beautiful moment for folks.

JILL: And a number of kids that just came up to us and it was like, “Would it be okay if I told my mom about your group?” And yes it would. And you know, “This is something that my mom really needs.” And “I hope that, or I wish that my mom was like this.” And I coordinate the Embracelets program and the people that were so excited, the number of people that came up to us and they said, “Look, I'm still wearing my bracelet from last year. And it's my little hug that I still have from you.” And, “Are you okay if I get another one?” And they're bringing in their friends to get more bracelets. So it's really heartwarming.

SARA: That is wonderful. I love that. I love the bracelets. Maria, I know, you’ve probably had dozens of conversations over the course of your time and years. Is there an interaction you've had at Pride that has stayed with you?

MARIA: I want to say that it was last year, and it was this woman with these two younger women that walked up to the booth. And one of the younger women said, “What's a Mama Dragon?” So then I just gave the elevator pitch about what we do. And she turns around and the woman that was with them is her mother. And she goes, “Oh that's you. Come on up, coming up.” And so the mom and I just started talking and she said, “Yeah, I wish there was an organization like this,” because her daughter was well into her 20's. So this had been something that she came out in her teens. And so, it's nothing new. And she said, “I wish there was an organization like this when my daughter came out because I made so many mistakes and I wish I could have talked to other moms and so maybe we could have avoided some of those mistakes.” Because I know Mama Dragons loves to get in touch with moms when their children first come out. But I think it's a lifelong journey because I said to her, “Well, you know, you can still join us.” I said, “because none of us has all the answers.” So she put her name down that she wanted to be on the mailing list. And so I loved that even though her daughter was an adult. And she still felt like, “Yeah, maybe I can still learn things.” So I’m like, “Yeah, I'm learning every day and I'm making mistakes every day.

SARA: Indeed. Indeed. Yanira, I'm curious if, when you're meeting parents at your Pridefests, if you see parents who maybe reminded you of yourself early in your journey?

YANIRA: Well, for example, they sometimes they feel, or you see their faces that they feel like lost. And there's hope, and that when they find that there is a group that can support them, that they find, “Okay, there’s answers. There’s people like me. I am not alone in this journey.” And we validate that that person's journey is also important because our family is coming out with our sons or daughters. And we are doing this fight because of their right to exist and have the same liberties as all individuals. So this year, some of the psychologists and counselors that came to gather information were, “Wow, thank you for existing. I didn't know these resources were available for some of the parents that I received in my office.” And some of the dads that came, “Is there a dad’s available group?” because they also want a group for them to talk about the things that are their concerns with their children. And they are amazing. Some of the partners of the moms in the group like they say, “Wow, you celebrate your birthdays. You join calls. You do that a companionship in all that you do. And this is amazing.” So when I see a mom that is just getting to know the first answers and she feels lost, I’m, “Okay we got you. And we know because we were there. And just give it time, one day at a time, and we have you. We can help you. And whatever it is you need, telephone numbers, resources, we will be with you all the way.”

SARA: I appreciate that so much. I just kind of want to reiterate that particularly for any folks listening who may be new on this journey. That’s such a powerful statement that you just gave that “We've got you. We've got you, so find your local Mama Dragons.” And that is why we exist to reach out and help each other along on this journey. Jill, I am curious if you have a story, maybe about a young person who stopped by that really touched you in some way.

JILL: It's not a young person. It's a middle school teacher. She came up to us and she said, “Can I tell you guys a story?” Of course. And she said, “I came to a Mama Dragons booth many, many years ago.” And she said, “My daughter who was with me, who's now an adult said, ‘Mom, I think you need to talk to these people.’” And she said, “You know, I came and I learned about Mama Dragons and I got to show you something.” And she pulls up her sleeve and she has this, she has our logo tattooed on her, and giant. And she said, “You know, this has become such a conversation piece with my students in my classroom. You know, I have to be really careful being where I am right now in the classroom.” But she said “People will come up to me and they'll say, ‘Well, what does your tattoo mean?’” And she said, “That means that I am a safe person and I'm here for you and you can always talk to me. And no matter who you are or who you love, I am that person for you.” And it was just like, she had all of us crying and she's had this tattoo for several years. And it was a beautiful experience just to hear her testimony.

SARA: That is a fabulous story. I really want to see this tattoo now. But yes, and you bring up this beautiful point about the kind of ripple effect, and the reach of Mama Dragons beyond just moms. And I think more and more particularly in this political climate being a resource for schools and counselors and places that are also trying to support that kind of community connection is really important. And parents can offer that unique perspective of what are the concerns that our young people are having in schools that teachers might not think about. I love that story.

JILL: Yes.

SARA: Now there's going to be a slate of tattoos. I think we need a thread on Mighty. If you have a Mama Dragons tattoo, let's start a thread on Mighty. Post your pictures so we can all admire it and cheer for it. That's great. I'm curious to hear from each of you this question: How has becoming such a visible ally changed how you understand queerness and/or your child and the idea of courage in those spaces in general? How has becoming an ally changed you in some way? Yanira, how about you?

YANIRA: In my case, I have felt that for my regional group they see me as, like a leader. And I just tell them, “No this is from all of us” But you're like a reference point or modeling how you are doing your things. But okay, it's important for my family. I want to share what I have learned with all of you because I want to put my effort to change the future because I want to spread that hope and that work. I feel more secure, more visible with that work because I'm not in a passive mode. I am working towards change and trying to spread that same energy to all the moms and to all the families that I give support as well. For example, in my regional group, we are doing a monthly reunion meeting. And we are trying to put a theme in that reunion. For example, If there is someone that is having problems with the pronouns or with the name change and steps that they need to complete, we try to prepare like a presentation with 10 to 12 slides, just to give that information because everything is important. Although it feels like I just know that, I just go through that in my family, that is not the experience and I have to have empathy for the other families as well and give them from what I learn. Because at the beginning, I have problems at school. Where did I learn how to have a reunion with the director and make some changes? In Mama Dragons, reading from other moms, reading from their experience. Okay I can do that let me read what is happening in Puerto Rico in that aspect in that location. So at first I read from all the stories I felt, okay, I am not alone. This is happening and I can try that strategy that I just read from a mother's perspective. So, giving from what I have been given, that's the gratitude effect that I want to spread with all the Mamas. And that is amazing. I feel great. I feel that I am doing something for the community that I now belong to.

SARA: That's wonderful. Maria, how about you? How have you being an ally changed you?

MARIA: I've become more vocal. Initially, when my child came out, I felt like it wasn't my story to tell. But then they empowered me and said, “No, Mom, I'm out at school. I'm out everywhere. I'm proud of it. There's nothing…” And so that was my anxiety that was holding me back. And I'm just grateful that they sort of said No, that you can say that your child is nonbinary and queer and that's okay. So once I got sort of that green light then it was like, okay, I'm going to be out here making as much noise as possible because the time for silence is over. And so if it's, I've recently gotten more into advocacy on the legislative side. So writing testimony to our state because every year there are some, they try to sneak in some really horrible laws that won't pass. But it's still important that we make our voices loud about it to say exactly why they shouldn’t be passed. And for the first time, I can't remember it was probably the spring of this year, that I was able to go down to the Supreme Court for a rally when they were arguing about banning trans athletes from high school. So that was a remarkable experience. And you want to talk about energy. It was just like, “Wow. This is pretty amazing, just to be there with like-minded people.” And it shows you that people are really care about all these issues. And so that's why we have to just keep sharing our stories and making our voices heard.

SARA: Yeah, agreed. Jill, how about you? How has being an ally changed you?

JILL: As you can probably tell, I’m much of an introvert. So it's been a challenge for me. But it has brought me outside of my comfort zone and really helps me see a lot of the challenges that our kids go through. The attacks that I get for being vocal are nothing compared to what our kids experience. And I would much rather that the attacks come on to me than any of our kids. And whatever I can do to shelter them, I'm willing to do it. Like Maria said, I was hesitant to be vocal at all until my child was an adult, just for her safety. And now that she is, and she's given me permission to do all that I can to make life easier for other kids as much as I can.

SARA: I want to talk about the general experience of Pride. I mean, we did talk about it a little bit in terms of it being, big community and lots of joy. But think particularly about those moms who might have not yet attended a Pride festival, who are really early on this journey? Or who might still be in the part of the journey that thinks, “I'm not sure if this is for me. Is this just for the community? Am I really welcome in the space like that?” What would you want them to know? Jill, let's start with you. Now that you've done it for some years, what would you want a brand new or a concerned mom who’s not been to know about what it’s like?

JILL: We actually had another Mama Dragon last year that was in those exact same shoes. And she was really nervous about coming. And she's like, “You know, I love to help out but I just don't feel like that's my place. Or I just don't think I can do it.” And we really encouraged her to come. And she did. And she ended up being there the entire weekend, all day Friday, all day Saturday, all day Sunday. And she was just so lifted up and so fulfilled. And like me, she is much of an introvert, and she was just blown away. And it made her more comfortable being able to advocate for her child as well. She was very much in the initial phases. She was having trouble with pronouns and it was all new to her. And it just transformed her and it was beautiful to see and to have the whole community embrace her and make her feel comfortable, and also make her feel comfortable for her child and know that you know her kid was going to be okay.

SARA: Yes, that's a great reminder. Yanira, what about you? What would you want a mom who’s not been to Pride before, what would you want them to know about what it's like?

YANIRA: I want them to know that they will find there so much love and that diversity that they should give themselves an opportunity to build that. For example in my case, at the beginning I was concerned about the safety. But I have found that this is an activity that is that strong sense of that we are community, we are family, and that we are going to make you safe. I feel from the very beginning that I was in the correct space. So, give yourself the opportunity to feel that and to be there at your own pace because there is so much joy and it's very important to you feel and to perceive that for yourself. My first one was “Wow, Wow amazing.” and like a healing process for myself. From that time on, I just, okay, I am not afraid anymore and I am in the correct space and I am doing what I need to do.

SARA: That’s great. Maria, how about you?

MARIA: I mean, I think everyone should go to Pride. It is just like you were saying, it’s not just for the LGBTQ community. It’s just an amazing experience for anybody to go. And if a new mom maybe doesn’t feel comfortable being behind the booth and speaking with people, that's okay. Just go your first time to experience it. I mean, there's music, there's food, there's shows, there's tons of booths where you can buy so much great stuff. I'm always in awe of the makers because I have absolutely no artistic or creativity at all. So when I see all these things that people have made that are selling, and it's just fantastic. And so that was like kicking myself like, why have I never thought to go to a Pride event before? Because this is great. This is the best way to spend an afternoon ever.

SARA: That’s a very good sales pitch. I really like that a lot. I'm also curious to hear, for moms who are new on the journey and might be struggling or scared, what advice do you have for them just in general as moms? Like you know, think back to that time and kind of what were some of your early concerns and fears when your child came out? What advice would you have for moms who are new on this journey? Maria, let's start with you this time.

MARIA: Yes, it’s very vivid to me, having that fear of my child because as I said, they were very open about it and came out. And I thought, I'm certainly not going to recommend that they closet themselves because that's ridiculous. But I'm also fearful of how people respond. And there were some kids at school, because at that time they were in seventh grade. And there were some kids that were, I'm not even saying that nice because it was worse than that. At that time they were enrolled in a faith-based school and they were told some horrific things by members of their other classmates. And the administration was a little hand-tied as to how much support they could give, which also infuriated me. But I guess I took my cues from them. Like they sort of, I don't want to say expected it, but it didn't make them feel less because of what other kids were saying to them. And they also had very, very good friends that sort of circled the wagons around them. And so those kids also were really terrific at helping protect them at school. But it's a very real thing to be – obviously we worry about our kids all the time, especially in this case too. Then you have to add on top of that, you worry about their physical safety, worry about their mental health. And so my strongest recommendation is just, if your child came out to you, that means they know that you're a safe person. And so just lean it into that and keep that line of communication open and just not barrage them every single day about, “So, did someone say something to you today or what?” But just sort of weave it into your other conversations and because that communication really is a lifeline, and it goes both ways. The kids need their parents to be listening to them and “Tell me how I can help you and how I can support you.” Communication is key, especially when they're younger like that.

SARA: Yeah, thank you. That's really great. Jill, how about you?

JILL: It's kind of piggybacking on something that Yanira said earlier, but just find someone that is just a little bit further along in this journey than you are and rely on them as your support system. This was years ago, one of my children has a disability and another mom said, “You know, Jill, I always look to you because you're like two steps ahead in this same journey.” And I think that that applies to this as well. Like, you were saying you're with the name change or with pronouns or whatever it is that you're dealing with right now, that there is someone else that has been there. And you don't have to do this alone. You can find someone that can help you with those steps. And hold your hand, make it a little bit easier because there's no reason that we should have to start from ground zero. And there's people there for you.

SARA: That’s great advice. I love that. Looking out at the landscape and seeing who has progressed a little bit more. Even as you, I think, Yanira, you were talking about your group meetings, even in the practical logistical side like “Who do I go to for this? Who's a good queer therapist? Who do I go to for electrolysis, eyebrow waxing or even those all of those sort of oh-my-goodness logistical things I've never thought of before.” Just having other parents who've been down there can be so helpful. Yanira, what advice would you give to a new, maybe scared or struggling mom?

YANIRA: Well, as Jill said before, we don't have to do that alone. We can lean on each other. If you have a regional group or you have someone that is more experienced, every question is important. So, you have to do all the questions that you have, although you think it’s, “I'm bothering.” No! Every question is important and also that we don't have to have all the answers on that same day. Sometimes we figure out during the journey and in some aspects we need our children to lead because sometimes we find the answers during the journey by letting them lead the way in some aspects. But that source of support from other moms that are having experiences that are similar to ours is very important because for example, maybe we did a list of the physicians that are affirming or that are even safe to be consulting aspects of our children. Sometimes our kids, for example, in my experience when he told me about his journey at 16, he was so urgent to have everything. And I was like, “Give me time to process.” “No, I cannot give you time. This is my time. This is now.” And I was like, “Okay, I need to also have a space where I can talk and that I cannot feel judged because I need to process also but I need to configure how to work everything at the same time.” So we also need to be gentle to ourselves and to have a space for ourselves and journaling what I was experiencing, that was very a life saver too, for me also, because sometimes, “Okay I need to take this out of me and I cannot talk in front of my kid or in front of my partner. Okay, let me put that into writing and then maybe just burn that or put it in the trash or whatever you need to take those energies also from you.” But there is always a place that we can knock and have the information.

SARA: Thank you. This is all really, really beautiful advice. And Yanira as you were talking about how learning on the journey, it made me think about just parenting in general. When our kids were little and something that worked at that time to either get them to bed or get them to eat or whatever it was, nine months later, doesn't work. And you have to pivot and you have to learn something new. And that's really true throughout their lifespan and throughout their identities. They’re learning. It’s not fixed. We're always learning and growing and pivoting and keeping that mindset open, particularly for our queer kids as they are coming out is such a helpful – it made me really think about those times, such a helpful tool. Here we are. The Pride Month is over. I know there are some townships and cities that are still having their festivals and they'll get to have their beautiful days. But when you're reflecting back when the tents come down and the rainbow flags are put away and everybody goes home, what do you hope lasts after Pride is over? Jill, how about you?

JILL: I just hope that people in the community remember the love and the joy that is there and it is not going anywhere. It's difficult to remember sometimes that there are so many people out there that love you and are fighting for you and are not going to stop and I just want that to stick with the community.

SARA: Yes. Yanira, do you want to add anything to that? What do you hope lasts?

YANIRA: That sense of fighting in a good way that we need to continue doing this work because this is a continuum. We have to model that through all the months of the year because we are now leading the way to other parents that will be beginning with this journey later on. We are like constructing that pathway, so that it could be easier and that we can push towards different politics or different regulations so that it can be easier to thrive for children and kids in general.

SARA: Yeah. Thanks. Maria, what do you hope lasts?

MARIA: I think the sense of community because sometimes we can get a little fractured in our communities with differing opinions and just always – because a sense of community during Pride especially is amazing. And even I've seen people that I wouldn't necessarily think would be supportive and they are. And so I think when you look for ways that we're alike instead of looking for ways that we're different, that's always the best path forward, is to try to keep that sense of community strong year round.

SARA: Yeah, that's great. The one final question for all three of you to close out our conversation today. I’d love for each of you to finish this sentence: “The reason I'll keep showing up at Pride is. . . “ Yanira, can we start with you?

YANIRA: I keep showing up in Pride because I believe that we can all have a better future. I have hope that there's no need in the future to just fight for some spaces that we can actually have them and we have to build them and we have to stick together to get through it. Pride is a need to fight for some spaces and we all have the right to survive and to live and be there. So I am there because I will continue fighting for that right of existence in the community and as an individual.

SARA: Thank you. That's fantastic. Maria, how about you? “The reason I’ll keep showing up at Pride?”

MARIA: The reason I’ll keep showing up at Pride, Drag Queens.

SARA: That’s a great reason! I love that answer.

MARIA: Absolutely. I mean, it's a fun way to really demonstrate love and acceptance and to show, especially our children, that we love them completely. They're a whole person and so we love them, every facet of them. And to show the community in general that people need to stop – and I'm sounding like a broken record – but it’s like people need to stop looking for ways that they're different and attacking for that reason. And I think, just accept a person for who they are, if they're living an authentic life, and it's no business of yours, then just let them live. And so I think that's why we keep, we need to keep having Pride because a lot of people don't get that. And so until that message is loud and clear, I will keep going and of course enjoying all the fun aspects of it as well.

SARA: Thank you. Jill?

JILL: Well, of course I'm going to keep showing up to Pride to tie on embracelets because that's just what I’m going to do.

SARA: Excellent.

JILL: But I'm going to keep showing up just to show people that they aren't alone, to show the moms that they're not alone, to show the kids that they're not alone and everybody else that we're going to keep fighting for you.

SARA: I think maybe one of the reasons I'll keep showing up is to remind myself and be part of the reminder of this larger community and of the joyful acceptance and expression that happens at Pride that sometimes is hard to hang on to during other times of the year. Thank you all for this beautiful conversation. Thanks for being amazing Mama Dragons in your parts of the world and showing up at Pride in all the other spaces that you do. This has been great.

YANIRA: Thank you so much for having us.

MARIA: Thank you so much.

JILL: Thank you so much. 

SARA: Thanks so much for joining us in the den. Did you know you can connect with our Mama Dragons community on our own free, private, secure platform. In addition to our main support group we host regional groups for more localized connection and support, and affinity groups to connect moms with shared identities and experiences: including groups for gender diverse parents, political advocacy, mamas of transgender children, mamas of children with special needs, Madres Dragones – our Spanish-speaking moms – and moms of color. We also offer religious-based space groups from those grounded in faith to those navigating transitions out of it. Wherever you are, there's a group for you. You can learn more and join by visiting our website at mamadragons.org/join.

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